what should I say/ask as I leave my internship?

A reader writes:

I wrote to you about whether or not to extend my internship back in April (from the “Should I Extend My Internship” post) and thought I could share with you an update. After much pondering about weighing the pros and cons of doing so, I decided to go ahead and extend my internship. Yes, same internship, same manager too. I am just about to wrap up my internship and as I reflect back on whether or not it was a good choice, I believe that it was. I took the advice you gave about working on long-term projects and it did help a lot. I was able to do several projects on my own without a whole lot of assistance from my manager.

The only thing that gave me second thoughts about it was that I did feel as if I stuck around for too long. It's almost been a year now with the extension. I know I will not get a job offer from this organization due to a lot of budget cutbacks. One other thing, I didn't really have much of a mentor-mentee relationship with my manager as I had before. There were a few things I wanted my manager/mentor's advice on about my career goals, but I guess I just didn't feel comfortable approaching my mentor for advice anymore or maybe it was just the lack of time issue.

But overall despite the time issue, I think my manager is still one of the greatest mentors I've had. I did get a thank you gift and letter. I also do plan on staying in touch. Any advice on saying goodbye or what would be good questions or topics to say for that "final conversation?"

Yes! This is a really great opportunity to get feedback that can help you develop professionally. I'd ask things like:

* Do you have thoughts on where I did especially well and what things I should focus on improving in? (If you don't get a real answer to the last part of this when you first ask it, reiterate that you truly want to know. Some people get more honest when you make it clear you're not going to be offended. If she still won't tell you, phrase it this way: "If you could wave a magic wand over my head and tweak something about my habits or skills or approach, what would it be?")

* What kind of role do you think I'd really excel in?

* Can you think of anyone in your network who might be good for me to connect with for future openings?

Also, tell her what you got out of the experience and why it was valuable to you. In particular, tell her what a great mentor she was, and why. People don't say this sort of thing enough -- often because they think the person is too important or advanced in their career to care -- but people generally love hearing it. Even important and prominent people love hearing it. Say it!

(And not only is it a nice thing to do -- which is reason enough -- but it will also likely make her more invested in your professional future, or at least more willing to help you if the opportunity arises. People like people who like them.)

Anyone else have suggestions?

should I extend my internship?

A reader writes:

I am currently doing an unpaid internship that I am receiving college credit for this semester. I really enjoy working with my manager and after reading your previous post on extending the length of an internship, I decided to ask my manager about it. She was fine with it when I asked; however, she is always so busy between meetings, dealing with employees and doing her own work that I am often left just sitting there in her office watching her or I am asked to leave when she has an important meeting with someone. It's an internship where I am given random stuff to do so I do not have an actual desk/computer or any routine work that I can do when I come in. I tried talking to her about it a bit, but she only admited that her work keeps her busy.

What I like about it is that I can receive credit for a class and also, she really does try to do her best to make time for me when she can, but I feel like I am in her way or bothering her in her work at times. Is this worth extending the internship?

Well, first, I don't think you should make your decision based on a worry that you're in your manager's way. If you are, that's her issue to deal with -- by not saying yes to the extension. You're better off just having faith that she'll tell you if she can't accommodate the internship anymore, since otherwise you risk driving yourself crazy worrying that you're secretly burdening her.

Now, as for whether or not to extend the internship: It depends on what you want to get out of it. If you feel like you're learning things and getting useful experience, then sure. But otherwise, I would move on and look at other interning or volunteer opportunities that will benefit you in ways that this one isn't. I can't actually tell from your letter whether you feel like you're getting much out of this one or not; much of what you wrote sounds like it's not the most fruitful experience for you, but you do say that you're enjoying it, and I can't tell if you're bored or not, so a lot depends on that.

However, if you do want to stay, look for ways to improve the experience. Do you see projects that might be useful for you to take on? Or can you talk to her about whether there's something that you might work on long-term so that she doesn't need to spend time coming up with ways to occupy you? The best project in this situation would be something that would (a) benefit the company in some way, (b) not require tons of guidance from her, (c) take a good chunk of your time, and (d) not be high-risk, meaning that if it doesn't go perfectly, nothing disastrous will happen (so that she won't feel the only way you could do it is with a lot of guidance or oversight from her). 

But you can also always look at other internships out there. You might end up in something you like better, so I'd take a look at what other options you have as well. Good luck!

is taking an internship on top of a job unethical?

A reader writes:

I received my BA this May, and after searching, got a job as an Administrative Assistant. I'm really very grateful to have gotten this position as it seems like getting an entry level position right now is a bit of a crapshoot: so many people could perform this job admirably, but they can only hire one.

However, it's a tiny company (I'm one of five full time employees,) and it's in a slightly random industry, one that I was not planning to go in to. I suppose I should have planned better, but I had bills and I was in a bit of a scramble to find work.

The people I work for seem to understand that it's unlikely I'll be at the company forever as there are really no opportunities for advancement, given the size.

My question is this: I recently received an offer for an unpaid internship for a completely separate industry that I'm more interested in. The internship would be in the evenings, but it would require that I leave my job twice a week about 15 minutes early. I would really like to take this internship, because I'm still not sure what career path I want to pursue and I'd like to learn about different options. I thought perhaps I could ask my employers if I could come in a half hour early and leave a 15 minutes early.

(Note: As an admin, part of my job description is to answer phones. This is true, but at this particular office protocol is that I handle the phones from 8:30 to one, and then it defers to another employee. I'm not sure why this is their practice, but that's what I was told. Also, the office is rarely flooded with calls.)

My friends and parents say that I should refrain from telling my employers about the internship. They've mentioned that some companies have policies against employees working second jobs (although I reviewed the employee handbook and it made no mention of such a policy.) They've also mentioned hat my employers might worry this is me setting up to leave them and thus cut me loose before I do.

I commute about an hour to and from work every day - it should be less, but I live in LA, where traffic is attempting to stage a world takeover. Because of that commute, my friends and family are recommending that I tell my employers I want the time change because of traffic issues.

This feels sketchy to me. I don't want to mislead my employers. But it's tempting, because I can't afford to be fired at the moment.

I'm not planning to leave anytime soon - I'm learning some good stuff here, but I would like to learn more about other industries. Should I forgot the internship and just keep working? It's starting to feel like taking this internship would be like cheating or something.

Lying is rarely, if ever, a good idea. Here are some of the things could happen if you lie to your employer and say that you need to leave early because of traffic issues: Someone at your workplace could meet someone at your internship and realize they both work with the same person. A reporter could do a story about the place you're interning with and you could end up in it. The internship could call your current employer for a reference before hiring you, without alerting you that they plan to do so. Your current employer could ask you to stay late one day and you'd have to explain why you couldn't. And so forth.

And then you're not just "the admin who we know will leave us eventually" (which they already know), but rather "the admin who lies." A lot of managers would feel obligated to fire you at that point, even if they understood perfectly well why you wanted to take the internship -- the lying part of this would be the problem.

Plus, there's another consequence: You're going to feel guilty about it. Every day that you leave early to "fight traffic," you're going to feel guilt that your coworkers accommodated your request when you lied to them. (If you wouldn't feel guilty, you have a whole different problem, but I don't get that sense from your letter.)

Talk to your boss and explain the situation. Make it clear that your first priority is your job and if this would cause a problem, you won't do it. Say you don't plan on leaving the company any time soon but that this would be a great educational opportunity for you. Offer to do other things to make up for it (such as coming in early or taking a shorter lunch on the days you leave early). Ask what she thinks.

She'll probably say yes, although be prepared to be okay with it if she says no.

Openness is almost always better. Good luck!

extending the length of an internship

A reader writes:

My current summer internship is amazing. I want a full time position at this company but I do not think one is available. However, my internship doesn’t have a set “end date” and I am not sure how to bring it up with my boss (we have a good relationship). I am pretty sure time is running out for me, but I’d like to stay here as long as possible so I can get as much experience (and save money) as I can.

Just talk to your boss. Tell her that you're loving the internship and that you're wondering what they usually do for ending dates, because you're hoping to stay longer and not get kicked out at the end of the summer. The worst she can do is say that they can't extend it because they haven't budgeted for it, but she also might be thrilled to have you stay.

This is a normal thing to ask about; don't feel weird. You don't need to wait for a context or opening to bring it up in. Just email her or ask to talk in person.

I often would love to have interns stay on and curse school schedules for taking them away from me.

You should also mention that you'd love to work for the company full-time at some point. Just because you don't know of any available positions there doesn't mean that doesn't know of some coming down the pike.

internships: stay where I am or seek out new experiences?

A reader writes:

I am currently awaiting the start my junior year at a D.C. university and was fortunate enough to spend my summer in Washington, D.C. I threw myself into 50 hours of work per week - with two part-time internships and a part-time job.

With the summer now in full swing, I have already started applying to some fall internship opportunities. However, my concern is jumping around too much. I'm at two rather "entry-level internships" (if that's even a phrase) and would love a more prestigious position before I graduate. On the other hand, I love my internship coordinators and both organizations where I currently intern. As a career guru, what would you recommend? Is it better to sit still at an internship you like (I'm also doing an independent study in the non-profit's specialty) or climb the internship latter and experience all you can in four years?

I think it depends on the details of your current internships. Do you feel like you're on an upward trajectory, where you're continuing to learn new things and develop yourself professionally? And if you stayed with them longer, do you think that would continue, or would you quickly hit a point where there wouldn't be much more change or growth?

In many jobs, it takes a significant amount of time to truly master the job before you hit a point of diminishing returns -- which is why I think people should stay in any remotely challenging job for at least a couple of years, at a minimum. But internships are different; they're designed to be short-term -- often just a few months -- and so they often don't ever really get all that challenging.

I think you should talk with the internship coordinators at each of your current internships. Tell them how much you love being there and express an interest in staying on longer, and ask if they'd be open to letting you take on new projects and responsibilities if you stayed, so that you'd continue to gain professionally. If they're open to that, you've got a strong argument for staying.

On the other hand, there's no real wrong answer here. If you want to go out and explore other places instead, you should feel good about doing that too. There's an advantage to being exposed to different workplaces, different office cultures, different management styles, and different work.

You pretty much have a win-win situation here: Either you stay where you are and get the experience of growing within an organization, or you take advantage of the fact that you can actually do a lot of internship-hopping without it looking bad, because that's expected with internships. And by the way, I looked at the resume you sent and it's excellent -- so you're in really good shape. I'd go with your gut. Good luck!

how to get the most of out your internship

A reader writes:

I’m going to be starting a 3-month summer internship in the management consulting field for a reasonably small (~30 employees) boutique consultancy. I see it as the first step in my career goal to become a management consultant. My goals from this internship are:
1) To obtain a bunch of great contacts who will hopefully help me as my career progresses.
2) To start to build my reputation in the industry.
3) To learn as much as possible.
4) To obtain an offer for part time work for the rest of my university degree (something I know they’ve offered others in the past).

So, if possible, could you provide me some tips and advice to achieve the above goals? The main challenge is that this internship will really be throwing me in the deep end, so it’s likely that I’ll have to ask a lot of questions.

Oh, I love this question. I hope others will chime in with advice too. Here's my advice for all interns hoping to make a good impression and achieve the types of goals you listed:

1. Understand what to expect from an internship. The main point is to give you some basic exposure to day-to-day work in your field. In the vast majority of cases, you will not be doing glamorous, substantive work; you will be there to make other people's lives easier. This means you may get stuck doing things like photocopying, filing, arranging meetings, and other things that may strike you as drudgery. In exchange, you get exposure to the field and work experience to put on your resume.

2. However, if you excel at these boring tasks and do them cheerfully, you may be given more interesting work. Trust me on this. Many interns don't grasp this concept -- after all, what does being good at photocopying have to do with your ability to, say, do independent research? Here's why there's a connection: When you come in as an intern, you haven't proven yourself. (You can have a stellar academic record, but it still doesn't count as proving yourself in the work world.) But if you do a great job on the boring work -- yes, making the best photocopies you can make; odd as it sounds, there are ways to do that well and ways to do it badly -- you'll show that you pay attention to detail, follow instructions, and care about quality. Keep up a sustained track record of that, and eventually someone is likely to let you try your hand at something more interesting. But do a bad job on the basic stuff, and no one is going to trust you with anything more advanced. So go into it feeling that nothing is beneath you.

3. Don't worry that you'll need to ask lots of questions. Internships are designed to be learning experiences. However, to whatever extent you can, save up your questions and ask them in bunches. (This way, you're interrupting less but still getting the information you need.)

4. Ask for feedback. Every so often, ask your boss how you're doing. What could you be doing differently? Make it easy for her to give you the input that will help you grow.

5. One you get settled in and start to get to know people, ask them about themselves. How did they get into the field? What do they like about it? What do they find challenging? What advice do they have for you? Most people love to talk about themselves and will be flattered that you're asking for their advice. And it will make them want to help you.

6. You don't need to pretend to be older than you are, but do observe how others in the office act and roughly mirror it. For instance, if people modulate their voices when others are on the phone, modulate yours. If people are compulsively on-time for meetings, you should be compulsively on-time too. There are lots of little things like this that will help you appear professional by simply observing and mirroring what you see. Ad while these things may sound small, they will make you stand out compared to other interns they've had.

7. Toward the end of the internship, tell them you've loved working with them (assuming that's true) and how much you've learned. Ask if there are any possibilities of continuing to work there. And if that doesn't work out, ask if you can stay in touch. (They will say yes.) Then do it -- once the internship is over, check in with an email every so often, tell them how school is going, talk about what you're hoping to do next, ask if they have any leads or advice for you.

8. Oh, and don't wear flip flops.

Good luck! Just the fact that you're thinking about these questions puts you ahead of the game.

3 tips for managing interns

Summer intern season is approaching. Here are three tips for surviving it.

1. Don't cut the intern too much slack just because he/she is unpaid or low paid. You might not hold them to exactly the same standards you'd hold your regular staff to, but you should at least hold them to something close to that -- because otherwise the time that you put into hiring, training, and supervising them won't be worth it. Sometimes people feel like they can't hold interns very accountable because they're not getting paid or that they can't give them direct feedback about problem areas, but in my experience it's better to have no intern at all than to have one who you can't rely on or whose work is so sloppy that it has to be redone, etc.

2. On the opposite side of that, though, do recognize the person is working with no or little pay and find out what they're hoping to get out of the experience and see what you might be able to do to accommodate them. If they're hoping to get some experience writing something and you wouldn't normally have them doing any writing, see if there's a way to allow them to write a few small things (which you'd edit, presumably). Of course, sometimes this isn't practical; it depends on what exactly they're hoping to get experience doing. More often though, interns are simply looking to get "experience" and that can mean all kinds of things.

3. Assume interns won't know some really basic stuff about how things are done and that you'll need to give more guidance than you might with a regular employee. Make sure expectations and goals are really clear, check in regularly to monitor how their work is being executed so you can make course corrections if needed and give advice, and so forth. You also might need to explain things that would go unsaid with someone a bit older -- I've had to explain to interns in the past that they need to call if they're unable to come in (not just not show up without notifying anyone), that they can't play on MySpace all day, etc. The thing to remember is that a lot of the value of an internship for students is that it's how they learn this basic stuff about the work world -- so that when they're in a "real" position, they already know how things work. Ideally, you'll be someone who enjoys teaching someone this kind of thing; if you're not, at least see it as part of the "pay" you're providing them in exchange for their work.